[Freeciv-Dev] [patch #5995] civ2civ3: replace no incite and no bribe effects by increased costs.

[David Fernandez]

URL:
<http://gna.org/patch/?5995>

Summary: civ2civ3: replace no incite and no bribe effects by
increased costs.
Project: Freeciv
Submitted by: bardo
Submitted on: lun 13 abr 2015 20:16:06 UTC
Category: None
Priority: 5 - Normal
Status: None
Privacy: Public
Assigned to: None
Originator Email:
Open/Closed: Open
Discussion Lock: Any
Planned Release:

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Details:

Someone in the forums requested it long time ago, and I agree it is better to
penalize these actions with extra costs than to disable them completely under
certain gobernments.

I have hardly tested the costs of diplomatic actions in freeciv, and I'm not
confident to change them, but I have seen sveinung has made a lot of related
patched, and I'm interested to hear possible suggestions for civ2civ3.




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[Sveinung Kvilhaugsvik]

Follow-up Comment #1, patch #5995 (project freeciv):

_I'm interested to hear possible suggestions for civ2civ3._
Are you asking how you can implement a higher price (in gold) for incite and
bribe? In that case you should use the effects Incite_Cost_Pct and
Unit_Bribe_Cost_Pct with the "Gov" requirement type. Remember to open
game.ruleset and to remove the !present "Gov" requirements from the
target_reqs requirement vector of the action enablers for "Incite City" and
"Bribe Unit". (There is currently one action enabler for each of those actions
in civ2civ3)

The exact formulas for the price (in gold) for bribe and incite are located in
the functions city_incite_cost and unit_bribe_cost in the files
server/cityturn.c and common/unit.c.

I plan to make non gold costs more ruleset controlled in 3.0.

Let me know if you were asking about something else.

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[David Fernandez]

Post by Sveinung Kvilhaugsvik
Let me know if you were asking about something else.

My question was more about suggestions for rules related to diplomatic
actions, included bribe and incite costs. I have seen you have increased a lot
the modding capabilities of these actions and I was wondering if you had
something in mind when you did it, some rule or diplomatic gameplay that you
would like to see implemented, or that you have already done for your personal
use.

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[Marko Lindqvist]

Update of patch #5995 (project freeciv):

Planned Release: => 2.6.0, 3.0.0


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[Sveinung Kvilhaugsvik]

Follow-up Comment #3, patch #5995 (project freeciv):

_I have seen you have increased a lot the modding capabilities of these
actions and I was wondering if you had something in mind when you did it, some
rule or diplomatic gameplay that you would like to see implemented, or that
you have already done for your personal use._
I've had many ideas. The problem is that they are scattered across test rules,
notes, forum posts and other places. I planned collect them, organize them,
consider what may fit civ2civ3 and post the result here. I haven't done it
yet. I therefore think I never will.

I did manage to find a few of my ideas. They may or may not be appropriate for
the civ2civ3 ruleset:
* Allow establishing an embassy while the actor unit is inside a ship.
Establishing a trade route while inside a ship is legal. In my view
establishing an embassy is more like establishing a trade route than inciting
a city to change sides. An ambassador operates openly. A foreign embassy gives
the benefit of being able to contact its owner. (Disadvantage: a new rule to
remember)
* Allow using a caravan to help a team mate build a wonder.
* Should caravan actions require that the actor unit has moves left? If yes:
add the requirement.
* The acting player gets money from Enter Marketplace. The target city gets
nothing. Should enter marketplace (in stead of establishing a trade route)
require that the target city has a marketplace? Should it be illegal when
establishing a trade route is legal?
* Make getting caught while trying to have a city change side during peace
cause an incident. Currently the only time getting cause will cause an
incident is when the player tried to steal a tech during peace. Do the same
for steal gold and city sabotage if they become legal outside of war. (Steal
Gold is never legal in civ2civ3) Note: targeted and untargeted steal tech /
sabotage city are different actions.
* Allow a spy to steal large amounts of gold from the capital of a communist
nation. (By taking control over a central planning committee)
* Allow a spy to steal a small amount of gold from regular foreign cities.
Maybe require that the regular target city has a bank or another building you
wish to reduce the value of. Should it be legal outside of peace? If yes:
Increase the amount that is possible to steal from regular cities if the actor
and victim are at war.
* Add a Public Broadcaster (small wonder) or The BBC (big wonder). Could
require radio and communism. Have it increase the cost of bribing your cities
and units. (Propaganda helps your subjects stay loyal) Non action effect:
happiness. The propaganda makes the people less war weary during war. It makes
them happy when there is war in the world their nation isn't involved in.
* Make inciting cities and bribing units of players that are at war cheaper.
(They become war tired)
* Simulate colonialism: allow bribing cities (and/or units) when the actor
has AdvancedTechX but the victim don't even know BasicTechY.

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[David Fernandez]

Follow-up Comment #4, patch #5995 (project freeciv):

Good points. Thank you for the ideas.
I'm afraid I won't be able to work on freeciv for some time (due to some back
issues), but I'm liking the idea to introduce some of those changes to
civ2civ3 in the future.
I'm specially interested on points 1, 4, 5, 7, 9, 10.

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[Marko Lindqvist]

Update of patch #5995 (project freeciv):

Category: None => rulesets


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[David Fernandez]

Follow-up Comment #7, patch #5995 (project freeciv):

Sorry, I have been unable to play/test freeciv lately.

Should enter marketplace (in stead of establishing a trade route) require

that the target city has a marketplace? Should it be illegal when establishing
a trade route is legal?
I don't see any reason to keep it illegal.

I understand the creation of patch #6490 in order to keep old behavior, but I
think it is not really needed.

I like the idea to allow it (enter marketplace) as long as there is a
marketplace present in the city, no matter if trade route is legal or not.

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[Marko Lindqvist]

Follow-up Comment #10, patch #5995 (project freeciv):

"Enter Marketplace" stuff split to patch #7650.

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[David Fernandez]

Follow-up Comment #11, patch #5995 (project freeciv):

I'm testing a version where these governments get +100% costs instead of being
immune. Culture increases the costs up to +100%, and Courthouse effect is
reduced from +300% to +100%.
I'll create a new patch in the other site when ready.

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